有方 在Combinatory Urbanism一文中，您提及当下社会高流动性、复杂范式、未来之不可预测等特质，对您建筑设计语言的影响。假定当前社会确实有此特性，建筑可否以不同策略去回应它？墨菲西思作品中的复杂张力，可能是一种反映（representation）；但建筑可否是一个中性空间，作为背景，去容纳这种复杂；甚至以弱化、极简的策略，去抵制、消解当前社会的嘈杂与不稳定？
梅恩 我希望我们能面对面对话，因为你的问题很... 这里面有一个很有趣的连续性。你询问建筑与当代社会的关系，以及建筑师可否以不同的策略来回应；例如，墨菲西思是在反映社会条件，然后你说，我们可否反其道而行之，以极简主义来抵制这一趋势......是和可以。在今日的建筑学中，没有单一的元叙事。我们着迷于各不相同之物。
I wish we could be having a dialogue, because it would be a little smoother, because your questions are so.. there’s a continuity that is so interesting, it would be a little different if we could talk and if you were saying these words. Because again, in question 8, you go back and you discuss in terms of our book, Combinatory Urbanism, you ask about the relationship with contemporary society and can architects deal with these diverse strategies, for example, and are we mirroring social conditions, and then you say, can we actually produce minimalism to resist that tendency… (22:35) Yes and Yes. There is no singular meta-narrative today in architecture. We’re interested in something quite different.
I’m going to say that the relationship of an architecture that’s informed by whether it’s the notion of high mobility and its relationship to the ephemerality of our world, whether it has to do with the complexity of the multiplicity of the various global conditions, (that could be a long long discussion) that for us these are opportunities to expand the range of possibilities in architecture. And I’m just going to say yes, the work you’re looking at, going from the work going back to the way the work was generated, that these things that you’re asking - these conditions- that literally represent contemporariness, what it means to be alive and to be producing work at this time in history. It’s going to connect to the use of these things as opportunities. And that the complexity of the work is nothing more than a reflection of the complexity that represents the richness, the fullness of life, that is available to us to appreciate and to enrich us at human beings. Its as simple as that. And its seems as though architecture as an art form, maybe with cinema, has the capability of documenting and exhibiting this enormous range of subject matter, interest, on both an intellectual, conceptual, and emotional level, that becomes our material that we work with in terms of developing our ideas. (26:04)
I would expand that, that when you say contemporary human experience - yes, I just said that – that it’s somehow, its documenting, concretizing, interpreting notions of your perception of that experience, but that’s an enormous territory today and to begin with it would lead us to a discussion of the global nature of how we practice that goes back to your very first question about what it means to practice in china starting in 2005. Today we’re working, literally globally, we’re in Casablanca, we’re in Madrid, we’re in Milan, and we’re obviously all over China and Korea. So it opens up this questions, that when you’re discussing contemporary urban experience, we are in fact part of this idea of globalization, we’re actually part of that process, and our work is translating cross-culturally these issues. And we’re finding connective tissue between our different experiences of the world that we bring to the work. And that in itself represents and incredibly complicated construct that as we make these connections that we literally are part of the connective tissue between cultures, and then maybe that would be a complete separate conversation.
What’s happening of course now in China, is that China is becoming the receiver of this situation, as its architects - whether they’re from Italy or from Germany, or English, etc., that--that it becomes a receiver of a series of people interpreting culture and the complexity of political, economic, cultural events, and interpreting it through their lens, their vision of the world,would think if we could re-ask these questions in 50 or a 100 years, it’s going to be fascinating, and we’re going to look back and see this particular time in China not only as revolutionary and incredibly kind of powerful in your half a billion people move from this agrarian to an urban existence, which is already kind of a major phenomena that will define the end of the 20th century and the beginning of the 21st, but at the level of the questions you’re asking, having to do with the nature of architecture as symbolic of its time and of its situation, it''s going to make it a completely fascinating kind of place, because you have these multiple viewpoints, these multiple lenses that are looking at this situation and translating it, and it’s going to make some combination of the commonality of all cultures, as they reflect architecture.
And I think architecture it will become one of the more interesting aspects of what’s going on in your country at this point in time, and especially because this can be focused on the urban, which already is about the connective tissue, and is the most kind of heightened environment if you’re looking at social, cultural, political events.
Hopefully we would have a chance to meet sometime, because it would be really interesting to continue this conversation as a dialogue. I just wanted to say that as an end, because I have to say that, I’m engaged in how you asked the questions, and how you in some ways answered the questions you were asking, because you were already kind of moving me into a direction and hopefully we’ll have a conversation soon in Shanghai.
录像 | Jasmine Park
文字整理 | Nicole Meyer、Jaclyn Rusher、Carolyn Ng
文字及视频整理 | 沈璐妍、王亚珂
采编 | 原源
剪辑 | 赵筱雅
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